woo

[dreamer_easy]

Discovered the term "woo" at a particularly smug militant atheist blog this morning. Can't quite work out if it refers to falsifiable superstition and/or divisive OTWism, or to all forms of spirituality. These things are always confusing when you're a naturalist freethinker up to your elbows in gods. Require advice.

(Also need advice on an alternative term for "militant atheists" so as not to piss off majority of atheists who are not ignorant evangelising twerps. In the meantime here's something we can both enjoy: Fred Nile nosedives after distributing Islamophobic "survey". OWAG.)

ETA: By a circuitous route, however, that annoying blog did lead me to Dr. Scudder's Tales for Little Readers About the Heathen.

Comments

[hnpcc]

I always use "evangelical atheist", mostly because I don't see a huge amount of difference in the mindset between them and any other bloody fundamentalist.

[purrdence.livejournal.com]

Good point.

[endis-ni.livejournal.com]

My understanding of the term "woo" relates to dubious medical claims that at best can't be proved by double-blind randomised testing, and at worst can be proved by those same methods to be actively harmful. Bad Science possibly popularised the term (http://www.badscience.net/).

I reckon therefore that atheist blogs have taken the term for things that can't be empirically proved in religion. I could be wrong, though.

[kateorman.livejournal.com]

Ah! *goes for a rummage at Bad Science* Say, what's with the nutritionist rubber ducky?

[endis-ni.livejournal.com]

Ah, the unofficial mascot of everyone debunking, well, quacks. It was possibly Andy Lewis with his Quackometer (http://www.quackometer.net/) that started it.

[kateorman.livejournal.com]

*slaps forehead* Of course! :D

[captainlucy.livejournal.com]

...ignorant evangelising twerps...

Yup, sounds about right to me.

[antikythera.livejournal.com]

I've always used 'woo-woo' to describe pseudoscience -- Nibiru, ear-candling, Reaganesque astrology, etc. -- but as an atheist I group religion in a different place. That said, I remind myself that stuff like astrology and certain magic(k) related things are part of someone's religion somewhere.

[kateorman.livejournal.com]

Had to go look up Nibiru. As a kid I was quite worried that Pluto and Neptune would crash into each other.

wtf where's my science icon

[hiraethin.livejournal.com]

What's wrong with 'militant atheist' if that's an accurate description? Some non-militant atheists, like non-militant christians, will nonetheless get defensive about such descriptions applied to their militant fellows - but that doesn't make the word usage incorrect.

Now, 'ignorant evangelising twerps' is much more disparaging, and consequently should be used with more care... or in response to self-evident, twerpish behaviour ;b

OTOH, if you're simply looking for a different phrase to use, 'evangelist atheist' or even 'iconoclast' might do.

[kateorman.livejournal.com]

"Iconoclast" is no good - when our cousin converted from Paganism to Orthodox Judaism, he smashed all his idols!

[hiraethin.livejournal.com]

They were his idols, though. (I know the definition of iconoclast isn't specific as to ownership, but still.) Actually, the definition I was thinking of was "a person who attacks cherished beliefs, traditional institutions etc."

[zombie-buddha.livejournal.com]

I first heard 'woo' at Phil Plait's Bad Astronomy Blog, and he's usually pretty good about seperating religion (personal matter) from falsifiable superstition, so I'm pretty sure it's intended to refer to homeopathy, astrology, mayan calender/2012 nonsense, interventionist prayer, antivaxxing, psychic powers etc. People being what they are, it's pretty likely that someone out there is using it to refer to religion, though.

[kateorman.livejournal.com]

Ta for this! I'm a great believer in Stephen Jay Gould's "Non-Overlapping Magisteria", the equivalent of the imaginary line down the middle of a car separating the siblings in the back seat. When snake oil merchants make testable but untested claims, and when evangelical atheists make untestable claims, they're over the line. Don't make me turn this car around! :D

Nile party

[hnpcc]

OK, I admit I hadn't actually realised that Nile had a party with other people and everything. I think I always thought that he was one bloke who kept losing his deposit in the Senate elections. I really must read the ballot papers more carefully.

Even so, what the hell:

''God said we are supposed to be 'salt and light'. Our saltiness has been severely diminished. It's a very embarrassing time for us.''

I have been racking my brain over where in the Bible God told them to be 'salt and light', and how their saltiness has diminished by being completely bigoted. The only reference to salt (in a person sense) that I can think of is Lot's wife, and I'm fairly sure that wasn't supposed to be a positive example.

Any ideas?

Oh and I laughed a lot at the mental image of Fred Nile nosediving. Heh.

Re: Nile party

[kateorman.livejournal.com]

Here ya go:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salt_and_Light

I take anything Fred Nile says with a pinch of light.

[drhoz.livejournal.com]

Any mention of Quantum Healing Energies, Quantum Psychology, raising you to a higher wavelength, etc etc etc, is a good sign of woo.

[klgaffney.livejournal.com]

woo is increasingly often used within the pagan community too, to refer to anything from actually having a conversation with your gods/spirits, to dream/trance work, UPG (unverified personal gnosis) etc. mostly due, i think, to the increasing trend of discrediting anything to do with actual spirit-work with deity as a living breathing personality, and leaning towards describing them as metaphors, abstracts, archetypes, etc. (which is all well and good until one of them reaches over, gives you a good shaking, and tells you to sit down and damn well LISTEN to your elders for a change. >_>; )

[kateorman.livejournal.com]

Oh, that's very interesting indeed. On the one hand, I think a little skepticism with a k could do the Pagan community some good - there's plenty of snake oil out there. But on the other hand, it's lolarious to think of Neo-Paganism, of all things, nekkid magick polytheism, becoming secularised - presumably to gain mainstream acceptance.

These days my own Paganism is almost entirely confined to book-mucking. I badly need to return to ritual. When that happens there's gonna be UPGs all over the damn place. >:)

[lferion]

I'm with klgaffney on the use of 'woo' in many of the circles/communities/bunches of people I hang with.

Woo generally refers to 'spirit-stuff' that one does. In some of those circles there is an understanding of the possible tension between woo=positive and woo-woo=negative. Also woo having similarities with 'fu' (as in strength/power/ability) and 'foo' (that coding/computer catchall term that can be either good or bad & sometimes both simultanously).

[kateorman.livejournal.com]

So, for example, someone could have good woo-fu? :D